Former US intelligence officer David Grusch appeared on the Joe Rogan Experience, providing additional details on Unidentified Aerial Phenomena (UAPs). A Pentagon whistleblower, Grusch shared more insights, revealing some harsh truths. Jesse Michels, among the first to interview Grusch after his story broke, asserts with 100% certainty that Grusch is not lying. Furthermore, Grusch has received support from Karl E. Nell, a retired Army Colonel.
On the podcast with Joe Rogan, David Grusch makes a series of intriguing claims regarding UAPs and government involvement. He told Rogan a story about a high-ranking Navy officer who saw a strange triangular UFO above his car. Grusch highlighted that the officer is trustworthy. After the UFO encounter, the officer’s car paint changed to a milky white color, and there are photos of this. Grusch points out that there’s no normal explanation for why the paint changed so quickly.
When Rogan asked about the strange event and if there were pictures or a regular explanation, Grusch said he could not think of a normal airplane or technology that could cause this. He also mentioned that the incident happened in the continental U.S., where planes usually need special permission to fly at low altitudes. Grusch revealed that the witness kept the experience to himself for a couple of years before sharing it as the UAP Task Force was established.
Grusch discussed how he got into the UFO program. He said someone important in the intelligence community approached him and introduced him to a person with impressive academic qualifications and permissions. They met at a secret place and discussed a program about studying materials from unidentified flying objects that had crashed.
Grusch says that he and his colleagues, who had special access, confirmed this information by talking to about 40 people, including high-ranking officials. These people shared reports, documents, and their experiences, which Grusch checked with other sources. Everything matched, and Grusch became more sure that the program was real.
Grusch also talked about filing a complaint about facing negative consequences, keeping the identities of people who shared information safe, and how his claims about crashed UFOs became more credible and urgent. He explained that this complaint led to him giving classified testimony for about 11.5 to 12 hours before congressional staffers and lawyers in December 2022.
According to Grusch, the United States possesses a double-digit number of retrieved UAP crafts, with documented events dating back to the 1930s. He talked about an Italy UFO event that happened in 1933, called the Magenta case. A UFO with a disc shape crashed there and turned into a bell or acorn-shaped object. It was about 20 by 10 feet in size.
Grusch described there was nothing inside the UFO, and the Italians thought it might be a German experiment. They asked the Germans, but they said it was not theirs. The Pope and the Vatican got involved, secretly telling the U.S. through the Office of Strategic Services (OSS), which later became the CIA.
Interestingly, Joe Rogan asked about technology connected to UFO stories, like the idea that fiber optics came from studying UFOs. Grusch neither confirmed nor denied this, saying it is classified. He talked about how he has to be careful about what he says, going through a review process by the Department of Defense’s Office of Pre-Publication and Security Review (DOPSR).
According to Grusch, $22 million was given to Bigelow Aerospace in a program called AATIP. This money was meant for studying buildings and equipment related to unidentified flying objects (UFOs). Grusch talked about how they tried to get access to materials from UFOs, and it seems they might have had to enter forcefully, but he does not give all the details. He said they got pieces of a hallway from the 1950s. Grusch mentions that Dr. James Lacatski, a retired DIA intelligence officer who set up the UFO program that ran from 2008 to 2010, shared similar information in his book and public talks.
Grusch said the program had problems with bureaucracy. The CIA did not allow UFO materials from Lockheed Martin to be transferred to the AATIP program. This caused the program to end. After that, AATIP focused on studying strange occurrences at Skinwalker Ranch to please the government.
When it comes to details about the UFO materials, like where they came from or where they are now, Grusch said he cannot share that information. He suggests asking people like Dr. Lacatski for more details. Grusch disclosed that he came across intelligence documents suggesting that a certain foreign adversary had knowledge of the U.S. program through stolen information. He emphasized the potential security risks associated with such breaches.
Phenomena is Ancient
Grusch continued to share his perspective on the UFO phenomenon. He wanted to make it clear that he was not trying to blame anyone. He thought it would be good for everyone to be more open and honest about UFOs. He believes that if we talk about it more, it could lead to more jobs, more research, and better education.
He talked about the fundamental questions related to UFOs, such as the existence of extraterrestrial life and the nature of human consciousness. Grusch asserted with confidence, based on conversations with high-level individuals like Harry Reid, that we are not alone, and the UFO phenomenon is real.
“You know for humanity. Are we alone or you know what happens when we die? Well, I don’t know about that, but are we alone? Well, the answer is we’re not alone. And I know that with 100% certainty, which as an Intel officer, you never say 100%, but all things pointed towards based on the people I talked to…The phenomenon is real. It’s been going on for thousands of years. People have been seeing strange things and not everybody’s mass hallucinating. So that’s kind of my long diatribe about what’s happening.
Rogan asked Grusch what the people he talked to think about these strange objects. Grusch said some people use words like “extraterrestrial,” but the Schumer amendment uses “non-human intelligence” to cover more possibilities.
Grusch shared his thoughts and talked about Dr. Jacques Vallée‘s work on how UFO stories changed over time, such as people used to talk about witches, and now they talk about alien abductions. He touched upon the morphological similarities between historical accounts, such as the Foo Fighters in World War II and the more recent Tic Tac incident in 2004. Grusch discussed declassified Air Force reports from the 1950s describing flying objects with similar measurements to those observed in the Tic Tac incident, albeit labeled differently.
Grusch also mentioned Ezekiel’s Wheel and Vedic texts, highlighting ancient depictions of aerial battles and phenomena that resemble modern interpretations of UFO encounters. He suggested that there is a real and trippy phenomenon with an undetermined origin, presenting itself in various forms, including orbs and balls of energy. Grusch highlighted the idea of an interdimensional or shadow biome cryptocurrency, acknowledging the multitude of theories surrounding the nature of UFOs.
Grusch acknowledged the existence of a variety of entities but mentioned that the total number and the extent of their interaction with Earth are unknown. He highlighted the challenges in understanding these entities, particularly in terms of their physiology. Grusch mentioned that he had discussions with people familiar with biological analysis which implies that there is some understanding but not a complete picture.
Rogan then asked if there are different types of biological remains, and Grusch said yes, confirming that there are various retrievals. He further asked about interactions with these beings and if they share information or talk about human problems. Grusch replied it is a sensitive topic, and the people he talked to did not want to discuss it. He admitted there might be detailed records but said he does not know much about it.
Rogan further asked about possible interactions with live beings and when they happened. Grusch said he was told about specific events, but the details were classified. Some of those events go back a long time. They discussed alleged UFO stories such as President Eisenhower sending UFO wreckage to a military base. Grusch mentioned discussions about UFOs dating back to the late 1980s involving Senator Barry Goldwater.
Grusch brings up public statements by officials, like General Goldwater and Senator Barry Goldwater, supporting the idea that some people have known about UFOs for a long time. Grusch expresses hope for change and transparency, especially with current political figures in positions of influence. He mentioned individuals like Chuck Schumer, Jake Sullivan, and John Podesta, emphasizing the need for championing the disclosure of UFO information within the government. Grusch also brings up an interview with Mike Pompeo, the former CIA director, where Pompeo briefly mentions having seen the UFO file and states, “we have bigger problems.” Grusch suggests that Pompeo should clarify his statement for further understanding.
Consciousness
Grusch and Rogan further discussed human abilities and consciousness. Grusch mentioned the CIA Stargate program, which involved remote viewing. He shared a story about remote viewing involving a hostage situation and emphasized that there seemed to be a real feedback loop confirming the accuracy of the information obtained through remote viewing.
Grusch pointed out the work of Stanford professor Gary Nolan, who studied individuals with heightened abilities and observed increased activity in the caudate nucleus in their brains. They speculated on whether this part of the brain acts as a transceiver, allowing individuals to access information from higher spatial dimensions.
Rogan expressed his fascination with the idea that certain abilities could be emergent properties of human beings as they evolve. He noted that human communication goes beyond acoustic communication and discusses the limitations of verbal communication in conveying complex information.
Grusch added to this by mentioning experiences of alleged contacts where individuals reported receiving instant knowledge or nonverbal communication, such as QR code-like information. He referenced the work of Dr. John Mack, who studied people claiming alien encounters and mentioned the book “Proof of Heaven” by Dr. Eben Alexander, describing a near-death experience and the difficulty of expressing the acquired knowledge in human language.
Grusch talked about the 9-person presidential panel which would disclose the UAP story between 2024 and 2030. The bill has cleared the Senate but is threatened in the House by Mike Turner and Mike Rogers.
“As long as the house doesn’t kill the Schumer Amendment, which would be the greatest setback to humankind and US history literally. The presidential panel gets empaneled 90 days after the passage of the bill. If it doesn’t get killed, by Christmas, it will be in the National Security Act. The panel will be formed say February or March. Then they have a 300-day process to develop to process to develop an initial plan for the president, and I don’t know if Chuck Schumer and his staff are being crafty, but the 300 days if you do it out is the election. I don’t know if they want to make this an election issue.”
